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The e-cig - Anyone tried them? Empty2019-09-18, 9:28 pm by Hieronymus


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Post  Guest on 2013-05-27, 12:24 pm

E-cigs are rather crafty little things. They look like a cigarette, and I suppose they are cigarettes. Certainly, they give the smoker his accustomed dose of nicotine. But the differences are massive. The white bit of the cigarette (where the tobacco is in a proper cigarette) is an elongated battery. The brown bit (the tip of a normal cigarette) is a screw-in container of liquid nicotine. When you suck the end, the battery is activated and it vaporizes the liquid – and that’s what you inhale.

So I get my nicotine fix. But it affects no one and nothing around me. Because nothing is burned, there’s no smoke, no passive smoking, no smell, etc. There’s no ash on the carpet and no burnt holes in your settee. And you can dispose of those unsightly ash trays. It completely evades the smoking laws. I can legally smoke an e-cig, in the SOL, a pub, a restaurant, even an aeroplane! And apart from the advantages for non-smokers, it’s a good deal for smokers themselves – no smoke means no tar in your lungs, and they cost a tiny fraction of the normal cigarette. Nicotine – the e-cigs only output – is not a problem. In itself, nicotine is no more harmful than caffeine – it’s burning the stuff that has been the problem, and that no longer happens.

The government is looking to encourage use of the e-cig because they reckon nothing – taxes, warnings on packets, etc. – is going to discourage the one million hard-line, long-term smokers that remain. And it doesn’t seem to be working with the fastest growing cigarette market – teenage girls – either. If they encourage a move from cigarettes to e-cigs, they can cut the health bill better, and teenage girls can still look ‘cool’ without damaging themselves or others around them. So it is in the government’s interests not to raise taxes on these things.

I bought one last Friday. It’s cost me £4 to run so far – the equivalent of about 10 – 15 cigarettes. And I find it in every way satisfactory. I doubt if I’ll touch cigarettes ever again. There is one hang-up with it : I’ve been coughing like a good’un for the past two days, as my lungs clear all the gunge out, but long-term that’s a good thing so I’ll put up with it.

If you smoke and haven’t tried one of these things, get one. The e-cig is absolutely brilliant.
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Post  Hieronymus on 2013-05-27, 12:48 pm

Good for you Cutey. cheers

Anything that helps people improve their health is worth promoting. I have never smoked but my parents both did. My father died from heart failure at 42 years old and my mother died from lung cancer at only 51. Both were heavy smokers. Even as a child though I always detested smoking.

I think you still need to have an eye out for the 'etiquette' of using them. For instance some people I know still go outside the pub with their e-cigs because they get dirty looks from other customers! Also I don''t know if you remember last year a 'terrorist incident' where a bus was stopped on the M6 because someone saw a man with a trigger device and smoke coming from his rucksack (the man was of pakistani appearance). It turned out he was just having a smoke of his e-cig quietly, trying not to be obtrusive, and caused a major incident. So be careful where you light up!
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Post  Guest on 2013-05-27, 12:52 pm

It's debateable mate, i know many people who have these things, and they seem more addictive than ciggies.

Aren't these things also banned on all flights?
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Post  Guest on 2013-05-27, 1:03 pm

I'm sorry, Hieronymus, but the e-cig breaks no laws and affects no one around me. So the "etiquette" of the e-cig is that those giving dirty looks should update their ideas. I certainly will not be going outside. One other thing - if smoke was coming from the Pakistani chap's rucksack, it wasn't an e-cig. Because nothing is burning, there is no smoke from them.

Commachio - because the e-cig doesn't burn down like a normal cig, it is possible to 'smoke' them for longer at a time. That would mean taking in a bigger dose of nicotine than normal. So 'more addictive' is possible. However, as nicotine is about as harmful as caffeine, there's no real problem with that. Many of the major airlines have now examined the e-cig thing and approved them, as no one else is affected and, because there is nothing actually burning, they don't present fire danger either.

I'm sticking with this thing. And hopefully, other people will get their etiquette right.
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Post  Guest on 2013-05-27, 2:19 pm

cuteybuns wrote:I'm sorry, Hieronymus, but the e-cig breaks no laws and affects no one around me. So the "etiquette" of the e-cig is that those giving dirty looks should update their ideas. I certainly will not be going outside. One other thing - if smoke was coming from the Pakistani chap's rucksack, it wasn't an e-cig. Because nothing is burning, there is no smoke from them.

Commachio - because the e-cig doesn't burn down like a normal cig, it is possible to 'smoke' them for longer at a time. That would mean taking in a bigger dose of nicotine than normal. So 'more addictive' is possible. However, as nicotine is about as harmful as caffeine, there's no real problem with that. Many of the major airlines have now examined the e-cig thing and approved them, as no one else is affected and, because there is nothing actually burning, they don't present fire danger either.

I'm sticking with this thing. And hopefully, other people will get their etiquette right.

Good man, i'm not condeming them at them.

But i do have reservations about them, vapours, indeed harmless but still can be annoying for the more pc people.

They come in many a flavour, which some may find offensive (say on a plane), but i don't mind them.

.................................

I had a strange scenario with these e-cigs only last week.

My boss, (a smoker) was in hospitial for a few days with pissing blood, and then clots.
I took him to hospitial for checks, they kept him in and operated that very night, (a burst vessel in the bowel or something, thankfully)

But my point is, i also took aa American man, one of our main customers at present, who seems addicted to one of these e-cigs, puffing away and grumpy boss got the hump with him (i didn't notice any smell), maybe a bit of vanilla.

These two then had a big debate on these products..i kept out of it, but both were adamant they were correct.
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Post  Guest on 2013-05-27, 3:20 pm

You've raised a couple of good points there, Commo. I wasn't aware that they had any smell. If there is, and if it is stronger than a whisky, brandy, hot dog with onions, or garlic on a non-smoker's breath, I would certainly reconsider my usage of them. The problem here is that smoking-bashing has become a British sport. Shops here can't show cigarettes to the public - they have to be covered now. But milk, butter, cheese, pizzas can be sold cheap in offers, and drink can be sold cut price openly. It's just become a fad, and I absolutely will not pander to that trash. It's a matter of drawing a line between sense and bossy little brats who want to tell others how to live their lives.

I've heard of these different flavours but haven't come across them yet. I swear to god though, mate, if I can find a rum 'n' coke or Raquel Welsh flavoured fag, everyone can go to hell! Ha! Perhaps I've more to learn yet.
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Post  Hieronymus on 2013-05-27, 7:00 pm

Some brands of e-cig definitely have smoke, although it is actually only water vapour and is harmless, and some do have a menthol or other flavour and smell, again harmless. Some also have a LED light on the end. So they do look just like cigarettes, hence the dirty looks from people who quite innocently think they are real. And they are banned on airplanes and in airport terminal buildings.
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Post  Guest on 2013-05-27, 8:36 pm

Hieronymus wrote:Some brands of e-cig definitely have smoke, although it is actually only water vapour and is harmless, and some do have a menthol or other flavour and smell, again harmless. Some also have a LED light on the end. So they do look just like cigarettes, hence the dirty looks from people who quite innocently think they are real. And they are banned on airplanes and in airport terminal buildings.

1) Smoke which is "actually only water vapeour" is not smoke, though I'm glad we can agree that it is harmless.
2) As I've already said, I haven't yet come across the various flavours, though I appreciate you advising me that they too are harmless.
3) My e-cig does have an LED light on the end, as you say.

However, I'm not altogether clear about your next point. I quote : "hence the dirty looks from people who quite innocently think they are real". I quite accept that their error is innocent, of course, but can not quite understand why those who make no error should stand outside in the rain for those who have made an error. Don't you think it would be more precise etiquette if they stood out in the rain for making the error?
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Post  Guest on 2013-05-28, 2:20 am

Bought some on line, I went for the ones with the pack that looked like marlbro, gave it a week, maybe ten days. didnt help me at all, although I spent thirty five quid, on a loser [ONLY SPEAKING FOR ME] I gave them to a young girl I know, she has so far, been able to dispense with tobacco altogether, she was given my e tabs in November, So i recon its horses for courses. But its working For young Amy [ 26] but then again Ive been smoking for 53 years, not a great example to anyone Im afraid. The bottom line is,,,,,,,,,,Its only money when you give it a try, worth a go in my opinion.

still love my tobacco, especially with a drink. or after a meal. BUT,,,,,,IF YOU CAN PACK IT IN,,,,,,PACK IT IN?
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Post  Guest on 2013-05-28, 3:59 pm

Sorry to hear it didn't work for you, Bill. But, as you say, it's all horses and courses, isn't it? Plus, of course, a large dollop of luck. Poor old Hieronymus lost both her parents, one in early-40s and the other at 51, whilst I've smoked since 1960 and was already on 40 a day by 1990 and yet I haven't been to the doctor since 1991!

The thing is, I don't feel I've packed up smoking. I've still got a fag in my hand, and still feed a nicotine addiction. I just think I've refined my smoking so as to dump the bad bits - tar, cost, etc. and thus ditch ASH's bossy little ego trip. I'm still a smoker, 100%. Enjoy your cig, Bill - I'm on your side
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Post  Hieronymus on 2013-06-12, 3:19 pm

This adds a bit to this debate. E-cigarettes face regulation

Maybe the government just want an excuse to tax them to replace lost tax revenue from people quitting? The article only mentions regulation not anything about taxing them yet, but what do you think will happen?

Third Edit: Does it work now? Yay finally! got it working. I don't know what I was doing wrong! Its on the BBC Health News pages anyway.


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Post  cyprussyd on 2013-06-12, 3:22 pm

My her indoors smoked, much to my disgust, around 50 a day, she stopped completely with the help of e cigs and is now a none smoker.

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Post  Guest on 2013-06-12, 3:30 pm

Hieronymus wrote:This adds a bit to this debate. Maybe the government just want an excuse to tax them to replace lost tax revenue from people quitting? E-cigarettes face regulation
I can't get a connexion from the link, Comm.  But the government have embraced e-cigs to get the NHS cost down.  If they tax it, they discourage people from going in the direction the NHS needs. 

Syd, fair enough if Annette wanted to stop.  But a lot of people don't want to stop.  I tried one out of curiosity three weeks ago, nowt else.  I've no intention of stopping.  In fact the American health service advises long term smokers not to stop, because the stress to the system is more likely to bring on cancer than the cigs!  But I've taken to e-cigs like a duck to water, and see it now as an evolution in smoking - fags without the bad bits.  It can work in either way.
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Post  Guest on 2013-06-12, 6:10 pm

Hieronymus wrote:This adds a bit to this debate. E-cigarettes face regulation

Maybe the government just want an excuse to tax them to replace lost tax revenue from people quitting? The article only mentions regulation not anything about taxing them yet, but what do you think will happen?

Third Edit: Does it work now? Yay finally! got it working. I don't know what I was doing wrong! Its on the BBC Health News pages anyway.

Got it now, H.  I'm not sure this is leading to more taxation.  The way I read it is that it's for the bossy, foot-stamping little brats down at ASH to keep a measure of control.  They must have been worried sick, as the e-cig seemed to be circumventing all the anti-smoking legislation, which, of course, would have made them that most dreaded of all things - unimportant.

The tell-tale is that nicotine (un-burnt) is no more harmful than caffiene, but we must prevent promotion to children and non-smokers.  I presume promotion of coffee will also be regulated? - not.  That tells me all I need to know.

I do think more research on added chemicals is needed on the e-cig, however.  It hasn't been properly investigated yet.  But the government can do that without ASH's involvement, I presume?
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Post  Guest on 2013-06-15, 2:44 am

Yeah , I bought the full kit , plus the extra pack refills, over £50 , Tried em. Its like having a coughing fit, when you dont expect it. No satisfaction for me whatsoever.

Also the unit is so heavy, not at all like a fag. Still. now with legislation, will soon become obsolete. Like the pub I had, and others like me. But the Gov Sttill wants the tax.

Actually, a waste of money. But that was me.
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Post  Guest on 2013-06-15, 4:08 am

You're not alone, Bill.  I've spoken to other people who didn't like them.  The only problems I'm having with them are fun ones.  I've actually tried to light the end on two occasions!  Now, I've put my lighter in the kitchen cupboard out of the way, but I still put the e-cig in my mouth and look for the lighter.  The other thing I find myself doing is thinking 'I'll just finish this fag and then I'll do ...'  Silly bugger, I'm never gonna finish it - it doesn't burn down.  Sorry to hear about your pub, though I do understand why.  At midnight on June 30th., 2007 I shook hands with my local landlord and wished him luck.  I just figured if ASH want to run the pubs, then ASH could either finance their pubs or close their pubs - nothing to do with me.  And I haven't been back to this day.  Having converted entirely to the e-cig I could go back any time, but I walk past one and there's no desire to pop in at all.  ASH didn't cure me of fags, but they cured me of financing pubs.
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Post  Guest on 2013-06-16, 12:34 am

Unfortunately, jobs lost, and a social place for folks to unwind, gone down the drain. Villages now have a struggle to find a venue for their Jumble sales, Raffles, RAOB, cubs/ scouts etc. Not all Villages are privilaged with a good bus service, so folks are stuck. But never mind. The holier than thou brigade in the big citys, won.
God bless em. " SO SOD THE POOR PEOPLE ,,,EH?
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Post  Guest on 2013-06-16, 1:10 am

My feelings exactly, Bill.  The do-gooders got their way - and how much worse off we are for that!
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Post  cyprussyd on 2013-06-16, 7:36 am

Think its a shame to call them the do gooders, I used to smoke 60 a day and hope I'm not the reformed smoker but I have seen far to many die and suffer from the effects of smoking to see anything but good in measures to cut down users.

That said I do agree that the effects of drink driving, smoking bans, cheap supermarket beer and the cost of living in general has just about killed off the pub trade.

For me it goes a lot further, modern day living, out of town shopping centres and internet shopping is now killing of town and city centres, loan companies, amusment arcades, cheque cashing and charity shops thrive where Woolies and co once stood.

But, all that said I do my food shopping at Asda or Tesco and its a few years now since I bought clothing or Christmas presents outside my home, its all done on line.

When I visit the suppermarket I see trolley after trolley loaded with packs of beer, do gooders or people changing their life style?

I will be going to the pub today and will have one diet coke, I'm driving and Sunday lunch, its fathers day.

For good or bad I fear most who will be in a packed pub with me will be there for the same thing, how the place survives the rest of the time, no idea.

Bill mentions the down trodden poor, well I guess I fit the poor bracket, certainly could not afford to smoke now or go out for a few pints every night.

I do however live in a warm secure home with full central heating, wasn't always like that. Bathroom and toilet inside with a shower, remember the tin bath? Fully equiped kitchen, laptop and tablet, both with full internet and a 47 inch TV in the lounge, 32 inch in the bedroom and 15 inch in the kitchen. Kitchen and bedroom with full freeview and lounge with Sky.

I was at the arena on Tuesday, drove there in my 2012 car, out today and have my season ticket.

So maybe, just a suggestion, we poor may not be that badly off and just have different priorities on how we use our cash.


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Post  MrRAWhite on 2013-06-16, 7:38 am

If you breath nicotine in with these e-cigs, then I'm quite sure you will be breathing it out again when you exhale. So as far as I'm aware, they are rightly banned from areas where cigarettes are banned, or should be..Having said that, I'm glad to see people using these rather than obnoxious cigarettes, which are just disgusting in every way, shape or form..

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Post  Guest on 2013-06-16, 9:53 am

Think its a shame to call them the do gooders, I used to smoke 60 a day and hope I'm not the reformed smoker but I have seen far to many die and suffer from the effects of smoking to see anything but good in measures to cut down users.

I think ASH deserve all the derogatory terms anyone can think of.  Their sole purpose in life is self-importance.

Y'see, I was in favour of changes in the smoking laws.  I considered it appalling that non-smokers who wanted to go out for a drink (or even a meal!) should be forced to breathe my smoke.  I find it equally unfair that those people had to send their clothes to the laundary next morning because of the stink from my fags.  What offends me isn't changes to correct that situation but the way it was done.  Many landlords were quite happy to divide their pubs up into smoking and non-smoking areas (much like the old smoke rooms of pre-1970s).  But ASH wanted power and took authority over the pubs from the landlords, preventing those changes from being made.  They lied through their teeth to get as much power as possible - such as a building with a 100 x 60 yard hole in the roof (sports stadiums) is an "enclosed" public place!  

At the time of the ban, Yahoo ran a poll to see how many were/weren't in favour.  Two were in favour and 297 were against.  Many of those against were writing things like 'I stopped smoking twenty years ago' or 'I've never smoked in my life' but they objected to the civil rights of landlords being violated.

But Mr. Blair gave ASH their way - and landlords were left to pay the bills, minus the income.  It solved nothing.  All it did was remove a problem from one section of society and gave the problem to another section of society.  Two twelve year-olds sat around a table could have settled on something better than that ban.

That's why I openly regard ASH as 'the enemy'.  They've done nothing for society.  They've done plenty for themselves, however.
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Post  Guest on 2013-06-16, 12:20 pm

As usual, it was all down to money.

.......The huge cost to the NHS  of treating smoking related diseases.

The other side of the coin of course is that reduction in smoking means less tax revenue....

My local (WM) club has provided a smoking area. It is outside of course but is covered and sheltered from the wind.
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Post  cyprussyd on 2013-06-16, 12:28 pm

silvers wrote:As usual, it was all down to money.

.......The huge cost to the NHS  of treating smoking related diseases.

The other side of the coin of course is that reduction in smoking means less tax revenue....

My local (WM) club has provided a smoking area. It is outside of course but is covered and sheltered from the wind


Nothing that posh in Coxhoe, two benches outside, no cover.

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Post  Black Cat Kiwi on 2013-06-16, 11:32 pm

silvers wrote:As usual, it was all down to money.

.......The huge cost to the NHS  of treating smoking related diseases.

The other side of the coin of course is that reduction in smoking means less tax revenue....

My local (WM) club has provided a smoking area. It is outside of course but is covered and sheltered from the wind.

Firstly I'd just like to say how much I've enjoyed reading this tread with the various emotions.

Silvers - I've travelled regularly around the world for the past 20 years & have seen the move to "Smoke Free" laws which both NZ / Australia where amongst the very first in the world to now North America, Europe & Asia. The degree of success varies due to it being done different ways but the aim is always the same.
Common sense doesn't always prevail but the approach of your WM Club from my observations does.


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