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BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

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BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-22, 5:20 pm

@BBCLN
BBC Sport understands the Sunderland owner Ellis Short is prepared to give the Championship club away for free if buyer can be found to take on [ltr]#safc[/ltr]’s substantial debt

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  sunderpitt on 2018-02-22, 6:04 pm

cyprussyd wrote:@BBCLN
BBC Sport understands the Sunderland owner Ellis Short is prepared to give the Championship club away for free if buyer can be found to take on 
[ltr]#safc[/ltr]

’s substantial debt
In other terms pay him and his bank back?
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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Nostalgic on 2018-02-22, 6:13 pm

If this is the case it may be our saviour but with no transfer windows we will still have the same team which for me is far more of a worry than the sale of the club.

Our survival in this league is more of a pressing issue than a new owner.

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-22, 6:19 pm

sunderpitt wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:@BBCLN
BBC Sport understands the Sunderland owner Ellis Short is prepared to give the Championship club away for free if buyer can be found to take on 
[ltr]#safc[/ltr]



’s substantial debt
In other terms pay him and his bank back
No Sunders my negative friend. He has and is prepared to write the money owed to him off. Around 80 mil is owed to other banks..

You and many more want him out, he tried to make it easy to get him out and you still moan.

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-22, 6:26 pm

cyprussyd wrote:
sunderpitt wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:@BBCLN
BBC Sport understands the Sunderland owner Ellis Short is prepared to give the Championship club away for free if buyer can be found to take on 
[ltr]#safc[/ltr]





’s substantial debt
In other terms pay him and his bank back
No Sunders my negative friend. He has and is prepared to write the money owed to him off. Around 80 mil is owed to other banks..

You and many more want him out, he tried to make it easy to get him out and you still moan.
Owner Ellis Short is prepared to give Sunderland away for free if a buyer can be found to take on the Championship club's substantial debt.
Short has said he is open to offers for the relegation-threatened club, but has failed to find a buyer.
Reports had said the American would accept £50m for his shares.
But he is now ready to sell for nothing as long as any new owner takes on debts which stood, according to the last published figures in 2016, at £137.3m.
It marks a stunning fall in value with Short believed to have set an asking price of £170m as recently as late 2016, when the club was still in the Premier League.

  • Sunderland are club in crisis - Short


Around half of the debt, £69m, is owed to the London-based businessman personally and it is thought the billionaire may forego some or all of that figure as part of any deal.
The balance of £68m is owed to Security Bank Corporation, which is owned by Guggenheim Partners, while interest payments are currently running at approximately £8m a year.

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-22, 8:30 pm

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Hieronymus on 2018-02-22, 9:38 pm

Good news at last. This may well tempt some of those consortiums that were sniffing around last year.

I have been saying for ages that if Short ever cared for us he would do the decent thing, walk away and write off the debt directly owed to him. Seems he is now prepared to do that so I will give him credit for making it easier to get a new owner for us.

But my goodness this tells a story. If he had just invested some of the £100m PL income we got last summer we might not be in this awful position at all. And he would still have a more attractive and saleable asset, instead of a club in such dire straits that he can barely give away.

For such an 'astute' business man (as we so often read in any news article about him) he has a track record of making dreadful decisions where SAFC is concerned.
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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Black Cat Kiwi on 2018-02-22, 9:56 pm

Hieronymus wrote:Good news at last. This may well tempt some of those consortiums that were sniffing around last year.

I have been saying for ages that if Short ever cared for us he would do the decent thing, walk away and write off the debt directly owed to him. Seems he is now prepared to do that so I will give him credit for making it easier to get a new owner for us.

But my goodness this tells a story. If he had just invested some of the £100m PL income we got last summer we might not be in this awful position at all. And he would still have a more attractive and saleable asset, instead of a club in such dire straits that he can barely give away.

For such an 'astute' business man (as we so often read in any news article about him) he has a track record of making dreadful decisions where SAFC is concerned.
All crocodile tears for the press....I'm sure he'll do just fine out of his investment & end up with a better return on it than any residential investor ever would using the domestic avenues available otherwise he'd have long gone.

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-22, 9:56 pm

Hieronymus wrote:Good news at last. This may well tempt some of those consortiums that were sniffing around last year.

I have been saying for ages that if Short ever cared for us he would do the decent thing, walk away and write off the debt directly owed to him. Seems he is now prepared to do that so I will give him credit for making it easier to get a new owner for us.

But my goodness this tells a story. If he had just invested some of the £100m PL income we got last summer we might not be in this awful position at all. And he would still have a more attractive and saleable asset, instead of a club in such dire straits that he can barely give away.

For such an 'astute' business man (as we so often read in any news article about him) he has a track record of making dreadful decisions where SAFC is concerned.
The problem of taking an astute business man who thinks a football club is simply a business.

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  sunderpitt on 2018-02-23, 8:41 am

cyprussyd wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:
sunderpitt wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:[size=30]@BBCLN[/size]
[size=30]BBC Sport understands the Sunderland owner Ellis Short is prepared to give the Championship club away for free if buyer can be found to take on [/size]
[ltr]#safc[/ltr]







[size=30]’s substantial debt[/size]
In other terms pay him and his bank back
No Sunders my negative friend. He has and is prepared to write the money owed to him off. Around 80 mil is owed to other banks..

You and many more want him out, he tried to make it easy to get him out and you still moan.
Owner Ellis Short is prepared to give Sunderland away for free if a buyer can be found to take on the Championship club's substantial debt.
Short has said he is open to offers for the relegation-threatened club, but has failed to find a buyer.
Reports had said the American would accept £50m for his shares.
But he is now ready to sell for nothing as long as any new owner takes on debts which stood, according to the last published figures in 2016, at £137.3m.
It marks a stunning fall in value with Short believed to have set an asking price of £170m as recently as late 2016, when the club was still in the Premier League.

  • Sunderland are club in crisis - Short


Around half of the debt, £69m, is owed to the London-based businessman personally and it is thought the billionaire may forego some or all of that figure as part of any deal.
The balance of £68m is owed to Security Bank Corporation, which is owned by Guggenheim Partners, while interest payments are currently running at approximately £8m a year.

So I was right and you were wrong?
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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-23, 8:56 am

sunderpitt wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:
sunderpitt wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:[size=30]@BBCLN[/size]
[size=30]BBC Sport understands the Sunderland owner Ellis Short is prepared to give the Championship club away for free if buyer can be found to take on [/size]
[ltr]#safc[/ltr]











[size=30]’s substantial debt[/size]
In other terms pay him and his bank back
No Sunders my negative friend. He has and is prepared to write the money owed to him off. Around 80 mil is owed to other banks..

You and many more want him out, he tried to make it easy to get him out and you still moan.
Owner Ellis Short is prepared to give Sunderland away for free if a buyer can be found to take on the Championship club's substantial debt.
Short has said he is open to offers for the relegation-threatened club, but has failed to find a buyer.
Reports had said the American would accept £50m for his shares.
But he is now ready to sell for nothing as long as any new owner takes on debts which stood, according to the last published figures in 2016, at £137.3m.
It marks a stunning fall in value with Short believed to have set an asking price of £170m as recently as late 2016, when the club was still in the Premier League.

  • Sunderland are club in crisis - Short


Around half of the debt, £69m, is owed to the London-based businessman personally and it is thought the billionaire may forego some or all of that figure as part of any deal.
The balance of £68m is owed to Security Bank Corporation, which is owned by Guggenheim Partners, while interest payments are currently running at approximately £8m a year.

So I was right and you were wrong?
How on earth do you work that out

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Hieronymus on 2018-02-23, 2:29 pm

It is widely believed in financial circles (but not offiicial public knowledge) that Short is a major investor in SBC. Being a private financial institution they don't have to reveal who their major shareholders or investors are, like a bank would here and in EU. If you do a Google search on Ellis Short and Security Benefit Corporation you will notice that there are only a few results and this message comes up "Some results may have been removed under data protection law in Europe." Basically someone does not want us to know of any connection. Suspicious?

Add to that the high interest rates being charged, 7.5% plus LIBOR (curently over 2%, so over 9.5% on £70m loans taken out in 2014. Plus there is another £15m revolving credit arrangement at the same rates. Then take into account that these loans were taken out with an American outfilt, as if the UK and EU don't have plenty of banks used to loaning money to football clubs! So even more suspicious?

Add that those loans are secured on the SOL and the AOL and other freehold properties owned by the club. That may be standard practice but should be of great concern for those talking about administration being an option!

Furthermore i have no doubts that when the 2017 accounts are published we will find that direct debt owed to Short has been much reduced, using the money we got from Premier League and TV, plus the fee for Pickford. I expect none of the SBC debt will have been paid off at all.

So add up all this secrecy, suspicion and concern maybe it is not so surprising why I and many others, including Sunderpitt, are cynical about Short's latest offer even if I am pleased he has done it and I give him SOME credit for that.
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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Kipper on 2018-02-23, 3:03 pm

Hieronymus wrote:It is widely believed in financial circles (but not offiicial public knowledge) that Short is a major investor in SBC. Being a private financial institution they don't have to reveal who their major shareholders or investors are, like a bank would here and in EU. If you do a Google search on Ellis Short and Security Benefit Corporation you will notice that there are only a few results and this message comes up "Some results may have been removed under data protection law in Europe." Basically someone does not want us to know of any connection. Suspicious?

Add to that the high interest rates being charged, 7.5% plus LIBOR (curently over 2%, so over 9.5% on £70m loans taken out in 2014. Plus there is another £15m revolving credit arrangement at the same rates. Then take into account that these loans were taken out with an American outfilt, as if the UK and EU don't have plenty of banks used to loaning money to football clubs! So even more suspicious?

Add that those loans are secured on the SOL and the AOL and other freehold properties owned by the club. That may be standard practice but should be of great concern for those talking about administration being an option!

Furthermore i have no doubts that when the 2017 accounts are published we will find that direct debt owed to Short has been much reduced, using the money we got from Premier League and TV, plus the fee for Pickford. I expect none of the SBC debt will have been paid off at all.

So add up all this secrecy, suspicion and concern maybe it is not so surprising why I and many others, including Sunderpitt, are cynical about Short's latest offer even if I am pleased he has done it and I give him SOME credit for that.

Makes my brain hurt, but the administration question - can't be a good thing for the club, but would Short be better off going down this route? If that's the case then watch this space - can't see him wanting to write monthly £3mill cheque for much longer.
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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-23, 4:00 pm

Hieronymus wrote:It is widely believed in financial circles (but not offiicial public knowledge) that Short is a major investor in SBC. Being a private financial institution they don't have to reveal who their major shareholders or investors are, like a bank would here and in EU. If you do a Google search on Ellis Short and Security Benefit Corporation you will notice that there are only a few results and this message comes up "Some results may have been removed under data protection law in Europe." Basically someone does not want us to know of any connection. Suspicious?

Add to that the high interest rates being charged, 7.5% plus LIBOR (curently over 2%, so over 9.5% on £70m loans taken out in 2014. Plus there is another £15m revolving credit arrangement at the same rates. Then take into account that these loans were taken out with an American outfilt, as if the UK and EU don't have plenty of banks used to loaning money to football clubs! So even more suspicious?

Add that those loans are secured on the SOL and the AOL and other freehold properties owned by the club. That may be standard practice but should be of great concern for those talking about administration being an option!

Furthermore i have no doubts that when the 2017 accounts are published we will find that direct debt owed to Short has been much reduced, using the money we got from Premier League and TV, plus the fee for Pickford. I expect none of the SBC debt will have been paid off at all.

So add up all this secrecy, suspicion and concern maybe it is not so surprising why I and many others, including Sunderpitt, are cynical about Short's latest offer even if I am pleased he has done it and I give him SOME credit for that.
So because we dont like Short we take an unfounded bit of conjecture, put 2 and 2 together and come up with 5 to find just one more stick to hit him with.

At the same time he says he will throw away what he has invested and his shares along with the money we know is owed to him but can only give a little begrudging credit.

Yes I can see why he wants out, bit like saying Corbyn was a spy.

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Nostalgic on 2018-02-23, 8:15 pm

It would not be Sunderland without the carping element of supporters about one thing or another.

I know nothing about high finance and if he has had enough of shelling out to keep us afloat then fair enough by me.Short still gets my support for bailing us out after Drumaville was going under, for changing managers when he saw we were heading in the wrong direction, for backing his new appointments and giving more years in the Premier.

As various people have said elsewhere, this is not the first Chairman who has been hounded out so who in their right mind would take us on?

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-23, 8:27 pm

Well I did what was suggested and read up on Security Bank Corporation, it seems to be a very big business with many divisions.


Lets say Short is a major shareholder, there is no proof he is but, lets assume it anyway.


Short loaned HIS OWN money and he is happy to write that off.


Can he make the same offer about the money from Security Bank Corporation? I would suggest no, I would suggest other shareholders may have a say.


So yes you could say he wants his money back, greedy bugger or, you could say he is doing all he can ro attract new owners and reduce the debt.

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Billy D on 2018-02-23, 8:48 pm

We need a Mike Ashley type character.
Say what you like about him but he's got the mags financially secure.
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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Black Cat Kiwi on 2018-02-23, 9:44 pm

cyprussyd wrote:Well I did what was suggested and read up on Security Bank Corporation, it seems to be a very big business with many divisions.


Lets say Short is a major shareholder, there is no proof he is but, lets assume it anyway.


Short loaned HIS OWN money and he is happy to write that off.


Can he make the same offer about the money from Security Bank Corporation? I would suggest no, I would suggest other shareholders may have a say.


So yes you could say he wants his money back, greedy bugger or, you could say he is doing all he can ro attract new owners and reduce the debt.

Keep reading Syd....SBC is merely an investment as is SAFC & any actions would not unreasonably be dictated by to by what has to be made public. 

H alludes above on to how to make money if you've already got some using "Unforeseen payment charges" etc. at rates higher than those commercially available that a company with accountability to shareholder issues would have, which while in no way illegal, it should certainly be an eye opener to any non business person on what they'e missing out on!

You might like to look a little further afield if you've a few days spare & you'll be able to see many companies with an array of common interests with interesting references to little gems like, common ownership & allowances for miscellaneous extramural expenditure to individuals.


Slightly OT but there's a lot of readily available information on the schemes clubs allegedly use to siphon off "earnings" from the EU if you're ever so interested. Some are just smarter than others. On this subject and of course not SAFC, even you I would hope could accept the alleged corruption at FIFA should it exist would thus enable it to continue. Of course given what was once done to you Sad  I'd fully understand you not wanting to read about them. 

Ps. Now why's that damn accountant not in his office on a Saturday when you need him  Suspect

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Black Cat Kiwi on 2018-02-23, 9:46 pm

Billy D wrote:We need a Mike Ashley type character.
Say what you like about him but he's got the mags financially secure.
He sure knows how to run the numbers & has the thick skin to pull it off.

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Billy D on 2018-02-23, 9:51 pm

Black Cat Kiwi wrote:
Billy D wrote:We need a Mike Ashley type character.
Say what you like about him but he's got the mags financially secure.
He sure knows how to run the numbers & has the thick skin to pull it off.
Yes indeed.
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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-24, 7:54 pm

Lots of rumours today about 3 members of a consortium at game and Short in UK to meet them.

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Re: BREAKING NEWS FROM BBC

Post  Kipper on 2018-02-25, 12:45 am

cyprussyd wrote:Lots of rumours today about 3 members of a consortium at game and Short in UK to meet them.
please please let them be loaded and let them be great for the club and let them pull it off
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