SunderMad
Why not join in with our small but perfectly formed community?

We are always looking for new members so sign up and join in, its free.

SOME PEOPLE SEEM TO HIT A SNAG WHEN TRYING TO REGISTER! NOT SURE WHY? IF YOU HAVE A PROBLEM EMAIL ME AND I WILL SORT IT?
sundamad@aol.com
THE CATS NEXT GAME

Widget powered by WhatstheScore.com

Latest topics
» Predictions Week 8
Today at 2:00 pm by lesmac

» Fairweather fans
Today at 1:25 pm by cyprussyd

» Quiz 111
Today at 11:26 am by vinkel

» Who would have thought it
Yesterday at 8:24 pm by cyprussyd

» Predictions
Yesterday at 4:54 pm by Black Cat Kiwi

» No news is good news!
Yesterday at 4:02 pm by canary-dave

» RIP Kevin Beattie
Yesterday at 3:21 pm by Hieronymus

» Get well very soon Annette ..
Yesterday at 3:14 pm by Hieronymus

» MAJA
Yesterday at 2:57 pm by Hieronymus

» i walked past doctors surgery this morning
Yesterday at 2:55 pm by Hieronymus

Sky Sports-SunderMad Exclusive.
Sky Bet League 1
FcTables.com

Will this get us debating?

Go down

Will this get us debating?

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-07, 4:43 pm

Chris Coleman fights to build Sunderland legacy but what can be done about Ellis Short’s ownership? 


PHIL SMITH Email Published: 14:00 Updated: 14:38 Wednesday 07 February 2018 


Chris Coleman had barely walked through the door at the Academy of Light when he was asked, “Why not wait for the West Brom job?”. Tony Pulis had been dismissed just moments earlier. 


Coleman, there is no obsession with the Premier League and certainly no sense that his legacy depends on whether he manages there again or not. One suspects that he knew fine well that job was not coming his way before saying yes to Sunderland, but, even if it had, the thought process was that there is little to be gained, finances aside, by jumping on the conveyor belt of managers that are hauled around the bottom half of the ‘best league in the world’. You go in, keep them up, then what? Is there room to build a legacy? Rarely. 


Coleman, like so many before him, saw the chance to walk into a colossal club on its knees and write his name in the history books. A few months down the line and the challenge is every bit as daunting as he expected. 


Most of the problems, a limited January budget being one, he knew full well about. Some have probably taken him by surprise, particularly the continuing injuries and perhaps too the scale of the hangover from relegation when it came to wantaway players. 


With 16 games left, Sunderland’s Championship future hangs in the balance. The consequences of failure will be absolutely catastrophic and that weight will hang heavy in the coming weeks. ‘Nothing ever good came from a comfort zone’, he said on his unveiling. It will take some effort to haul this squad over the line. One or two gripes with formations and the like aside, supporters have thrown their weight behind a man who has taken on the greatest challenge a manager can face in the British game at the moment. 


Not going in to fight the fires at the bottom of the Premier League, but arriving once the blaze has taken hold and brought a club close to ash. Many of the clubs Coleman was expected to court will find themselves in this mess at some point. At some point, the wider game will have confront the excessive risks too many are taking to bridge the gap to the Premier League’s elite and the brutal shock therapy that has to follow when the gamble doesn’t pay off. 


How many more owners have to throw their millions in, only to discover there are no guarantees and lose interest before something changes? It is a moot point for Sunderland fans, who now consider what to do about Short’s absentee ownership. The situation is complicated. 


Everyone wants Short to sell, including himself, but, at the same time, the wreckage of his ownership has left a situation few want to take on. There is an eye-watering debt to guarantee and major losses to suffer on fading players before someone can even think about investing in the hope of an upward curve. In the interim, those left to sweep up the mess have little choice but to tighten the purse strings in line with rapidly declining revenue. If no sale materialises, 


Coleman will, in the long run, have to pull off an extraordinary couple of transfer windows and show his powers of coaching and motivation to haul Sunderland back from the brink. It is a task he believes is possible, one that Neil Warnock has managed at Cardiff this season, but clearly fresh investment is the only thing guaranteed to move the needle. In the short term, he needs 25 points from 48 to likely guarantee safety. 


Anger with Short and the hierarchy aside, fans will give him their backing to do so. Beyond that, talk of action grows and while most acknowledge that it is unlikely to force Short into changing course (and it remains critical that he does not palm the club off to the first and worst bidder), perhaps a protest or a show of unity could have a galvanising effect. 


Thousands upon thousands have already voted with their feet. That so many have stayed continues to inspire given the scale of decline over the last 12 months. Coleman stepping into the fray at Sunderland was a surprising development that could yet turn the tide. He will get nothing but support from those who in the meantime have every right to make clear their ire at those who pushed the club to the precipice. On home turf especially, it could even be something of a spark.

Read more at: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 46863
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  Hieronymus on 2018-02-07, 5:00 pm

Interesting article but the headine is a bit misleading since it offers no answers! Very Happy 

Basically we have to trust Coleman, and the players, to get it right enough times between now and end of the season to get 25 points. That looks unlikely but in football, as in life, unlikely things do happen. Have to keep the faith and am just about managing to do so. But it is difficult.

As for Short, sooner he is gone the better but it will only hapen in the summer now so no point in protests as that wil just rebound on the players.
avatar
Hieronymus
Admin Problem Solver
Admin Problem Solver

Posts : 9396
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 62

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-07, 5:26 pm

Probably agree with all of that H and the reason for Coleman coming and the problems he faces also make perfect sense to me, so that only leaves Short.

There are only two ways Sort to sell.


  1. He decides he has had enough so sells very cheap. Everything we know about the man tells us he wont choose that option.
  2. Make the club attractive to a buyer. For Coleman to keep us up with loan players, kids and no cash would, IMO be an easier sell, just think what we could achieve with backing.

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 46863
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  sunderpitt on 2018-02-07, 5:40 pm

In Short (pun intended)

We are up shit creek without a paddle

I still wonder if are insolvent, then administration follows, we can write off the debts, apparently some £200m? Then we emerge Sunderland new co 2018


This is a move that POTUS Fat Grump has used several times to dodge creditors
avatar
sunderpitt
Number Cruncher
Number Cruncher

Posts : 7178
Join date : 2012-08-25

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-07, 5:47 pm

sunderpitt wrote:In Short (pun intended)

We are up shit creek without a paddle
In trouble yes but with Coleman here we have a paddle

I still wonder if are insolvent, then administration follows, we can write off the debts, apparently some £200m? Then we emerge Sunderland new co 2018
Honestly dont think that is the plan


This is a move that POTUS Fat Grump has used several times to dodge creditors
No idea what this means

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 46863
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  Nostalgic on 2018-02-07, 6:03 pm

Administration is not the way to go as it will just kill the club off since we will be subject to stringent legislation before coming back.  Portsmouth and Coventry are evidence of that,and  to a lesser extent Leeds. Southampton's parent organisation went out of business but the club itself avoided sanctions financially. 

Another season or two of toughing it out isn't beyond us as it is in our DNA. Maybe a reflection about players wages should also be taken into account when looking at our problems as well.

Nostalgic
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 4062
Join date : 2012-08-06
Age : 80
Location : Auckland NZ

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  sunderpitt on 2018-02-07, 7:17 pm

cyprussyd wrote:
sunderpitt wrote:In Short (pun intended)

We are up shit creek without a paddle
In trouble yes but with Coleman here we have a paddle

I still wonder if are insolvent, then administration follows, we can write off the debts, apparently some £200m? Then we emerge Sunderland new co 2018
Honestly dont think that is the plan


This is a move that POTUS Fat Grump has used several times to dodge creditors
No idea what this means

Coxhoe is on another planet? First you do not know about the Simpsons.. now you seem not to know that POTUS IS President of the United States..

Never mind  the prose you pen is very nicely 18th century.. forsooth
avatar
sunderpitt
Number Cruncher
Number Cruncher

Posts : 7178
Join date : 2012-08-25

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  oldblackcat on 2018-02-07, 7:26 pm

This season was always going to be a hard one and it's turning out to be harder than any of us would ever of drempt.

The chairman cutting back the funds was to be expected,but cutting them to absolutely  nothing was a shock.....I thought we would have had a little investment to enable us to at least challenge for a play off place and get back to the Premiership (speculate to accumulate)although after last season's non performance I did fear being nearer the relegation zone.

Dark clouds have followed us right through this season but I saw a chink of light break through when Coleman was appointed manager,then I saw a few more strands of light breaking through when he started to get rid of players that didn't want to be here.No money has forced his hand on the recruitment side,but with loan deals and young players stepping up to the mark more faint beams of light are breaking through.Whether or not the light breaks through enough and holds back the storm clouds of the third division we have to wait and see but Coleman oozes confidence and belief and if/when we stay up I believe he will start his vision of rebuilding the club and bringing back good times to the SOL.

Coleman has said he knew what situation he was walking into when he took on the job as our manager and I just hope if/when we stay up Short realises  what a great job he has done and gives him a little money to enable him to fulfill his vision of rebuilding our club.

Being better than 3 more teams in this league is the aim of this season and if/when we do it I believe we will all look back to this hard dark season and see it was the beginning of the re-birth of our club,led by a manager and a team that are proud to be at our club and make us proud and bring back the pride and respect our club deserves.
avatar
oldblackcat
Quizmaster
Quizmaster

Posts : 2430
Join date : 2012-08-20
Age : 57
Location : washington

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-02-07, 7:36 pm

oldblackcat wrote:This season was always going to be a hard one and it's turning out to be harder than any of us would ever of drempt.

The chairman cutting back the funds was to be expected,but cutting them to absolutely  nothing was a shock.....I thought we would have had a little investment to enable us to at least challenge for a play off place and get back to the Premiership (speculate to accumulate)although after last season's non performance I did fear being nearer the relegation zone.

Dark clouds have followed us right through this season but I saw a chink of light break through when Coleman was appointed manager,then I saw a few more strands of light breaking through when he started to get rid of players that didn't want to be here.No money has forced his hand on the recruitment side,but with loan deals and young players stepping up to the mark more faint beams of light are breaking through.Whether or not the light breaks through enough and holds back the storm clouds of the third division we have to wait and see but Coleman oozes confidence and belief and if/when we stay up I believe he will start his vision of rebuilding the club and bringing back good times to the SOL.

Coleman has said he knew what situation he was walking into when he took on the job as our manager and I just hope if/when we stay up Short realises  what a great job he has done and gives him a little money to enable him to fulfill his vision of rebuilding our club.

Being better than 3 more teams in this league is the aim of this season and if/when we do it I believe we will all look back to this hard dark season and see it was the beginning of the re-birth of our club,led by a manager and a team that are proud to be at our club and make us proud and bring back the pride and respect our club deserves.
APPL APPL APPL APPL APPL

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 46863
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  sunderpitt on 2018-02-07, 8:38 pm

oldblackcat wrote:This season was always going to be a hard one and it's turning out to be harder than any of us would ever of drempt.

The chairman cutting back the funds was to be expected,but cutting them to absolutely  nothing was a shock.....I thought we would have had a little investment to enable us to at least challenge for a play off place and get back to the Premiership (speculate to accumulate)although after last season's non performance I did fear being nearer the relegation zone.

Dark clouds have followed us right through this season but I saw a chink of light break through when Coleman was appointed manager,then I saw a few more strands of light breaking through when he started to get rid of players that didn't want to be here.No money has forced his hand on the recruitment side,but with loan deals and young players stepping up to the mark more faint beams of light are breaking through.Whether or not the light breaks through enough and holds back the storm clouds of the third division we have to wait and see but Coleman oozes confidence and belief and if/when we stay up I believe he will start his vision of rebuilding the club and bringing back good times to the SOL.

Coleman has said he knew what situation he was walking into when he took on the job as our manager and I just hope if/when we stay up Short realises  what a great job he has done and gives him a little money to enable him to fulfill his vision of rebuilding our club.

Being better than 3 more teams in this league is the aim of this season and if/when we do it I believe we will all look back to this hard dark season and see it was the beginning of the re-birth of our club,led by a manager and a team that are proud to be at our club and make us proud and bring back the pride and respect our club deserves.

Well said that man.. several wins are needed
avatar
sunderpitt
Number Cruncher
Number Cruncher

Posts : 7178
Join date : 2012-08-25

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  Nostalgic on 2018-02-07, 8:39 pm

oldblackcat wrote:This season was always going to be a hard one and it's turning out to be harder than any of us would ever of drempt.

The chairman cutting back the funds was to be expected,but cutting them to absolutely  nothing was a shock.....I thought we would have had a little investment to enable us to at least challenge for a play off place and get back to the Premiership (speculate to accumulate)although after last season's non performance I did fear being nearer the relegation zone.

Dark clouds have followed us right through this season but I saw a chink of light break through when Coleman was appointed manager,then I saw a few more strands of light breaking through when he started to get rid of players that didn't want to be here.No money has forced his hand on the recruitment side,but with loan deals and young players stepping up to the mark more faint beams of light are breaking through.Whether or not the light breaks through enough and holds back the storm clouds of the third division we have to wait and see but Coleman oozes confidence and belief and if/when we stay up I believe he will start his vision of rebuilding the club and bringing back good times to the SOL.

Coleman has said he knew what situation he was walking into when he took on the job as our manager and I just hope if/when we stay up Short realises  what a great job he has done and gives him a little money to enable him to fulfill his vision of rebuilding our club.

Being better than 3 more teams in this league is the aim of this season and if/when we do it I believe we will all look back to this hard dark season and see it was the beginning of the re-birth of our club,led by a manager and a team that are proud to be at our club and make us proud and bring back the pride and respect our club deserves.
I t will be a slog and a half to survive but to be honest I feel we have the quality, young or old, to see us through.

Nostalgic
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 4062
Join date : 2012-08-06
Age : 80
Location : Auckland NZ

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  Hieronymus on 2018-02-07, 10:13 pm

oldblackcat wrote:This season was always going to be a hard one and it's turning out to be harder than any of us would ever of drempt.

The chairman cutting back the funds was to be expected,but cutting them to absolutely  nothing was a shock.....I thought we would have had a little investment to enable us to at least challenge for a play off place and get back to the Premiership (speculate to accumulate)although after last season's non performance I did fear being nearer the relegation zone.

Dark clouds have followed us right through this season but I saw a chink of light break through when Coleman was appointed manager,then I saw a few more strands of light breaking through when he started to get rid of players that didn't want to be here.No money has forced his hand on the recruitment side,but with loan deals and young players stepping up to the mark more faint beams of light are breaking through.Whether or not the light breaks through enough and holds back the storm clouds of the third division we have to wait and see but Coleman oozes confidence and belief and if/when we stay up I believe he will start his vision of rebuilding the club and bringing back good times to the SOL.

Coleman has said he knew what situation he was walking into when he took on the job as our manager and I just hope if/when we stay up Short realises  what a great job he has done and gives him a little money to enable him to fulfill his vision of rebuilding our club.

Being better than 3 more teams in this league is the aim of this season and if/when we do it I believe we will all look back to this hard dark season and see it was the beginning of the re-birth of our club,led by a manager and a team that are proud to be at our club and make us proud and bring back the pride and respect our club deserves.
Brilliant post OBC clapy
avatar
Hieronymus
Admin Problem Solver
Admin Problem Solver

Posts : 9396
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 62

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  MrRAWhite on 2018-02-07, 10:56 pm

It is damned hard been a Sunderland fan right now, but turning their backs on the club, which many fans have done, is putting the whole future of the club in peril..

________________________________________________________
Born a Sunderland fan, live life as a Sunderland fan and will die a Sunderland fan..
avatar
MrRAWhite
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 4891
Join date : 2012-08-01
Age : 58
Location : Sunderland

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  vinkel on 2018-02-08, 7:46 am

oldblackcat wrote:This season was always going to be a hard one and it's turning out to be harder than any of us would ever of drempt.

The chairman cutting back the funds was to be expected,but cutting them to absolutely  nothing was a shock.....I thought we would have had a little investment to enable us to at least challenge for a play off place and get back to the Premiership (speculate to accumulate)although after last season's non performance I did fear being nearer the relegation zone.

Dark clouds have followed us right through this season but I saw a chink of light break through when Coleman was appointed manager,then I saw a few more strands of light breaking through when he started to get rid of players that didn't want to be here.
No money has forced his hand on the recruitment side,but with loan deals and young players stepping up to the mark more faint beams of light are breaking through.Whether or not the light breaks through enough and holds back the storm clouds of the third division we have to wait and see but Coleman oozes confidence and belief and if/when we stay up I believe he will start his vision of rebuilding the club and bringing back good times to the SOL.

Coleman has said he knew what situation he was walking into when he took on the job as our manager and I just hope if/when we stay up Short realises  what a great job he has done and gives him a little money to enable him to fulfill his vision of rebuilding our club.

Being better than 3 more teams in this league is the aim of this season and if/when we do it I believe we will all look back to this hard dark season and see it was the beginning of the re-birth of our club,led by a manager and a team that are proud to be at our club and make us proud and bring back the pride and respect our club deserves.
Cant agree with that, to me it's been manager after manager coming in and and getting rid of the unwanted. And where has that got us?.Just a constant stream of change.

________________________________________________________
Today i am as young as i ever will be.
avatar
vinkel
National News Correspondent.
National News Correspondent.

Posts : 2427
Join date : 2015-02-02
Age : 67
Location : wear valley

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  oldblackcat on 2018-02-08, 1:41 pm

There's a difference between getting rid of players that don't want to be here. .....and players that aren't wanted vinkel 

We have had a high turnover of manager's and each manager prefers their own players but in the background have been players that have had high wages and have stuck around for the money giving little or no effort when they did play. ....these are the ones that needed to be weeded out and coleman has started the process leaving players that want to be here and fight for the club. ...this is why I have hope that he will sort out the mess our clubs in and turn our fortunes around
avatar
oldblackcat
Quizmaster
Quizmaster

Posts : 2430
Join date : 2012-08-20
Age : 57
Location : washington

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  gil t azell on 2018-02-08, 9:24 pm

oldblackcat wrote:This season was always going to be a hard one and it's turning out to be harder than any of us would ever of drempt.

The chairman cutting back the funds was to be expected,but cutting them to absolutely  nothing was a shock.....I thought we would have had a little investment to enable us to at least challenge for a play off place and get back to the Premiership (speculate to accumulate)although after last season's non performance I did fear being nearer the relegation zone.

Dark clouds have followed us right through this season but I saw a chink of light break through when Coleman was appointed manager,then I saw a few more strands of light breaking through when he started to get rid of players that didn't want to be here.No money has forced his hand on the recruitment side,but with loan deals and young players stepping up to the mark more faint beams of light are breaking through.Whether or not the light breaks through enough and holds back the storm clouds of the third division we have to wait and see but Coleman oozes confidence and belief and if/when we stay up I believe he will start his vision of rebuilding the club and bringing back good times to the SOL.

Coleman has said he knew what situation he was walking into when he took on the job as our manager and I just hope if/when we stay up Short realises  what a great job he has done and gives him a little money to enable him to fulfill his vision of rebuilding our club.

Being better than 3 more teams in this league is the aim of this season and if/when we do it I believe we will all look back to this hard dark season and see it was the beginning of the re-birth of our club,led by a manager and a team that are proud to be at our club and make us proud and bring back the pride and respect our club deserves.
Best post for quite a while.
avatar
gil t azell
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 5314
Join date : 2012-08-03
Age : 58
Location : Sunderland

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  Vincemac on 2018-02-08, 10:15 pm

gil t azell wrote:
oldblackcat wrote:This season was always going to be a hard one and it's turning out to be harder than any of us would ever of drempt.

The chairman cutting back the funds was to be expected,but cutting them to absolutely  nothing was a shock.....I thought we would have had a little investment to enable us to at least challenge for a play off place and get back to the Premiership (speculate to accumulate)although after last season's non performance I did fear being nearer the relegation zone.

Dark clouds have followed us right through this season but I saw a chink of light break through when Coleman was appointed manager,then I saw a few more strands of light breaking through when he started to get rid of players that didn't want to be here.No money has forced his hand on the recruitment side,but with loan deals and young players stepping up to the mark more faint beams of light are breaking through.Whether or not the light breaks through enough and holds back the storm clouds of the third division we have to wait and see but Coleman oozes confidence and belief and if/when we stay up I believe he will start his vision of rebuilding the club and bringing back good times to the SOL.

Coleman has said he knew what situation he was walking into when he took on the job as our manager and I just hope if/when we stay up Short realises  what a great job he has done and gives him a little money to enable him to fulfill his vision of rebuilding our club.

Being better than 3 more teams in this league is the aim of this season and if/when we do it I believe we will all look back to this hard dark season and see it was the beginning of the re-birth of our club,led by a manager and a team that are proud to be at our club and make us proud and bring back the pride and respect our club deserves.
Best post for quite a while.
I think we may just stay up 
But next year there will still be no money 
Until the yank has gone
avatar
Vincemac
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 7238
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 66

Back to top Go down

Re: Will this get us debating?

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum