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Like MOST marriages ......

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Like MOST marriages ......

Post  cretanmakem on 2018-01-11, 10:05 am

I could have posted under 'apathy for the game ' but decided as per my wont and my egotistical nature I WANTED my own thread . 
My last post ( a while ago ) I said I hated SAFC ,,,, the word hate was a feeling inside me , taken however you personally wanted to take it . As of then and now a couple of months later that feeling hasn't diminished this shambles of a club has finally got right up my fkn nose . 
I am sick and tired of the names SHORT and BAIN , KONE and N'DONG , and the words of DOOM and GLOOM and mostly FAILURE .
This club has taken my hard earned cash ( at times when I could most not afford it ) it has taken my heart on a weekend , it has taken my spirit . 
Like many of us 'oldies' I have a failed marriage well behind me , some ( I admire you ) work through your troubles and keep it going , some ( I admire you even more ) create a success of a failing marriage and go on and on eternally to make it even better than before . 
I always thought SAFC was a 'marriage' to me , didn't matter who , what , why , where or when we would be bound together , that initial passion keeping burning through the bad times , that thrill that could and in my mind would never fade and would keep me looking forward to the next match , the chance we would redeem ourselves and actually win a couple in a row . But like a worn out tired wedlock have I finally realised flogging a dead horse doesn't work ? 
Hate was and is maybe too strong a word for my disillusionment but apathy is not right either . 
Living abroad made life difficult to follow the team , in the Premier it was made easier , now in the Championship it is nigh impossible . My connection to manager and players is virtually non existent , I cannot in all honesty comment on virtually any of them , I haven't seen them perform live or on the box , all I get is a result ( like living in the 40's probably without a tele ) . Nowadays that just is not enough . So as hard as I try to keep this 'marriage' going and as much as I would want it to find new happiness and contentment it looks like that horse is nigh on not only dead but buried . 
Frustration and fury rule in my heart in regards to SAFC , how the fuk did it come to this ? A rudderless ship with captain Coleman doing his best knowing the owners have given him a rust bucket without Lloyds giving him some comfort for his family if and when he sinks without trace into the deep blue depths of gloom called Division One . Oh my heart bleeds for him and his good intentions to get his rusty partner to safety in calmer waters known as Mid table mediocrity . Where did it all go wrong ? Hate , apathy , anger , call it what you will our marriage is dying in front of our eyes and marriage guidance counsellor SHORT couldn't give a toss ( and the children of this marriage look to have been aborted or thrown away for a generation ) .

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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  TNT on 2018-01-11, 11:24 am

When the manager thing dragged on for a couple of weeks I said I had just lost interest in who we got in as it would be IMO the same old same old from manager, players and club. My apathy kicked in then watching so called professional athletes not bother their arses and being paid more in a week than most earn in a year.
I was asked by a nag this morning who our best player was at present ( a genuine question from one of the few decent nags I know) and, in all honesty I was stumped not one player is standing out from the crowd. Maybe with Coleman apparently identifying the problem and trying his best to sort it with loans and probably free agents we could start moving, not holding my breath though.
The one problem Coleman cannot solve is the biggest problem, Short. I don’t think it’s apathy it’s just people finally waking up to being ripped off and deciding not to go to games and not to buy merchandise. That will harm the club as a club but, if that’s what it takes to get rid of Short then that is what it takes.
A few kept saying we have the nucleus of a good team not sure what team they are watching but, it’s not Sunderland.

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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Billy D on 2018-01-11, 1:16 pm

Both excellent posts.
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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Hieronymus on 2018-01-11, 3:06 pm

Good to hear from you Cretan. I thought it was us who were hibernating not you on your warm island!

The pain many of us feel right now is partly due to our helplessness and inability to fix things. In our daily lives we like to feel we can control things that make us happy or sad. Unfortunately supporters have no control over SAFC and, while some persevere, in their belief that the club needs our support more than ever ( quite understandable) others, like me, have lost all desire to attend matches, and barely watch, or listen even when we can. That is the only way we can maintain a semblance of control over our emotions and anger at how low we have fallen.

But..... despite largely agreeing with Cretan and talcs views, I am sure that IF the (almost) unthinkable happens and we get a few decent loanees in, and manage to get those confidence boosting wins, the green shoots of hope will return for all of us.

Being a football supporter is not quite like being in a marriage it's more like being part of a dysfunctional family. Sometimes you hate them, sometimes you love them, sometimes you lose touch for years, but usually, when it counts, you are there for each other. All things must pass, and this will too. I do still believe this despite our dire straits at the moment.

Just ask Sid MCFC how quickly things can change for the better - out of the blue, literally! Very Happy
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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Kipper on 2018-01-11, 3:58 pm

Hieronymus wrote:Good to hear from you Cretan. I thought it was us who were hibernating not you on your warm island!

The pain many of us feel right now is partly due to our helplessness and inability to fix things. In our daily lives we like to feel we can control things that make us happy or sad. Unfortunately supporters have no control over SAFC and, while some persevere, in their belief that the club needs our support more than ever ( quite understandable) others, like me, have lost all desire to attend matches, and barely watch, or listen even when we can. That is the only way we can maintain a semblance of control over our emotions and anger at how low we have fallen.

But..... despite largely agreeing with Cretan and talcs views, I am sure that IF the (almost) unthinkable happens and we get a few decent loanees in, and manage to get those confidence boosting wins, the green shoots of hope will return for all of us.

Being a football supporter is not quite like being in a marriage it's more like being part of a dysfunctional family. Sometimes you hate them, sometimes you love them, sometimes you lose touch for years, but usually, when it counts, you are there for each other. All things must pass, and this will too. I do still believe this despite our dire straits at the moment.

Just ask Sid MCFC how quickly things can change for the better - out of the blue, literally! Very Happy
So true. I work with a Man City fan who followed them through the dark days of the third division home and away and is now reaping the rewards of his loyalty all those years ago and is pretty much getting to see any game he wants - and some pretty good ones have come their way.

We need to hope that good time come through new ownership sooner rather than later. There's teams that have gone through a lot of pain but come back. I'm trying to ignore the ones who haven't - Coventry being a prime example I guess (sorry to mention them on a Sunderland forum).
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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  canary-dave on 2018-01-11, 4:15 pm

Sid won't thank me for reminding him of this but a few years ago when Citeh were trying to get back up the leagues they were drawn against Lincoln in the League Cup. I was living in Lincoln at the time and went to the match which Lincoln won 4-1 in the home leg. 

A friend of mine at the time was a Lincoln supporter and asked me to go with him to the return leg at Maine Road. Man. City totally dominated the match and hit the woodwork several times but couldn't put the ball in the net, Lincoln had a break away in the second half and scored, ending up 1-0 winners. 

At the final whistle the Lincoln team came over to the away crowd to thank the supporters and to a man, the whole lot of Man. City supporters rose and applauded the Lincoln team. I have had a soft spot for them ever since, they must have been gutted but were very sporting.

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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  cyprussyd on 2018-01-11, 5:33 pm

Could not be bothered to write it all again so copy and paste it is.

I find this a difficult topic but so far apathy has not set in but I find it hard to say why.

I agree that the money now being paid is obscene particularly when you look at the amount of need in the world but I wonder just how obscene it would be if Sunderland were buying 100 mil players?
Add to that how I still love to watch the Cities of this world play but in short, the money is now a million miles from Sunderland so it does not affect me.

Now how about the shambles that is Sunderland, I'm surprised any of us have hair or fingernails left.
Short has been a disaster although I'm not sure if he is a bad man or simple a rich man who has had is fingers burnt once to often. In truth, does it matter, he will go when he goes and not before.

Bain I have no gripe with, he has been handed an impossible job and is doing is best IMO.

So why do I still go to games, not for pleasure I assure you.

I arrive at the ground at 1.10 and the gates dont open until 1.30 so 20 minutes sitting on a low barrier and prayers it won't rain.
In at 1.30 and no option but taking my seat, I cant stand around so 1.5 hours sitting doing nothing.
At 3 the game starts and usually I get 20 minutes of entertainment before we concede and its then sit and shake my head.

So why do I do it, one answer, Chris Coleman.

I like everything about our manager, I know he is not universally liked but he is liked by me.

He seems to be trying hard to do what we have been calling for, a rebuild in personal and attitude and he is doing it with both hands tied behind his back.

I want to help and the only way I know how is to turn up and say you are not alone Cookie, I appreciate you and will suffer with you.

Nieve, silly, foolish, daft, use whatever words fit but it's just something I want to do for him and my club.

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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Nostalgic on 2018-01-11, 6:31 pm

Drawn to SAFC like a moth to a flame., not good for your health but fascinating. I marvel at our great escapes since 2012, the new seasons,  but once they are in your blood they stay there.  From braving the weather and growing up with the tales of the "old fellahs" on the terraces to sitting in the relative comfort of the SoL things have not changed.  11 blokes in red and white carrying or all your hopes "that this could be the season" to leaving the ground the ground mumbling and grumbling 9s just a tapestry that goes on forever.

In the final analysis most of us know that we are always going to be at a certain level, but hope springing eternal - one of the seasons it will happen. Won't it.

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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Red black cat1956 on 2018-01-12, 9:08 am

These last two posts illustrate why Sunderland fans, are the best, opinionated passionate but true legends.
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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  oxfordshire on 2018-01-12, 11:23 am

My thought is fairly simple. I was brought up in the 50s and 60s supporting Headington United. Who are they you might ask. At the time I had a penfriend in Sunderland and so my relationship with safc commenced. Headington were in the Southern league and employed Arthur Turner as Manager. After lots of attemts and changing their name to Oxford United they achieved fourth division status because Accrington Stanley were at deaths door. Sunderland were gods in my eyes. Never been relegated etc etc. Oxford eventually made it to the top league, first division in those days. Sunderland won the cup. OXFORD WON THE MILK CUP. But Oxford are a small club. They slid dowm the leagues back to non league. Their ground holds just over 12,000 and they rent it. They are looking at alternatives. They are working their way up again. The owner interacts with the supporters. He talks to the press. They are currently 10th league one. They have a good manager inPep Clotet. They have gone back to the previous policy of acquiring young promising players who they can develop and maybe sell for a million or two. Occasionally sell a player for $2 mill. Need the proceeds to keep afloat but the fans are relatively happy and produce good away attendances up to 2 or 3 thousand very occasionally. Sound familiar?
It is a slow progress but really if they get to the championship they are going to find it hard to compete buying players.
Here is the analogy with Sunderland who are fi di g it impossible to compete buying players.
So how the heck are sunderland going to compete if they ever get to the epl again. Any new owner will have to put in millions and millions and unfortunately the market appears to be soaring above the reach of all but a few clubs at the top of the epl.
What are the odds of the much vaunted super league coming about sooner rather than later which I believe will be good for British football allowing the less affluent clubs to compete better amongst themselves.
This is not a doom and gloom post but what I feel is a real look at the task. Not Chris Coleman's task really but a Bain task I feel as Short appears to be missing in action.
We obviously need new owners with lots of spare cash. Is that likely?
Probably not but we live in hope.
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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Hieronymus on 2018-01-12, 12:33 pm

Red black cat1956 wrote:These last two posts illustrate why Sunderland fans, are the best, opinionated passionate but true legends.  
I agree. Some great posters on here.
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Post  Sid MCFC on 2018-01-12, 12:36 pm

I’ve avoided posting for a little while as I would hate it if you thought I was being somehow patronising. I think it’s pretty obvious how much I like and respect Sunderland fans and I assure you I know how you are feeling. 

 It damn near took over my life when City were really really shit but I did keep on going although it was a little hard dragging my sons there.  As Kipper suggested because we kept our season tickets instead of going to two pre season friendlies at Scarborough in the bad days one of my sons is coming to Basel with me next month.

Fans will never have any say in who owns their club but I’ve always felt it’s the fans that truly own the club.  If I’d been asked not so many years ago if City would ever again get in the top ten of the prem I would have laughed my head off.  I’m stunned to see how Short is treating a great club and pray you will sooner rather than later get an owner the fans deserve.

I’m certainly not suggesting that fans should keep attending as I can understand the thinking behind not lining that arseholes pocket any more but I do hope you keep your chins up and stay proud of a traditional marvellous club.

I wouldn’t dream of posting on any other clubs forum but really like being associated with the Sunderland fans albeit in a very minor way.  You’ve got a hell of a lot going for you but maybe you can’t see it at the moment.

Anyway enough of all that sloppiness I’ll be watching you tomorrow and wish you all the very best.
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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Hieronymus on 2018-01-12, 12:48 pm

oxfordshire wrote:My thought is fairly simple. I was brought up in the 50s and 60s supporting Headington United. Who are they you might ask. At the time I had a penfriend in Sunderland and so my relationship with safc commenced. Headington were in the Southern league and employed Arthur Turner as Manager. After lots of attemts and changing their name to Oxford United they achieved fourth division status because Accrington Stanley  were at deaths door. Sunderland were gods in my eyes. Never been relegated etc etc. Oxford eventually made it to the top league, first division in those days. Sunderland won the cup. OXFORD WON THE MILK CUP.  But Oxford are a small club. They slid dowm the leagues back to non league. Their ground holds just over 12,000 and they rent it. They are looking at alternatives. They are working their way up again. The owner interacts  with the supporters. He talks to the press. They are currently 10th league one. They have a good manager inPep Clotet. They have gone back to the previous policy of acquiring young promising players who they can develop and maybe sell for a million or two. Occasionally sell a player for $2 mill. Need the proceeds to keep afloat but the fans are relatively happy and produce good away attendances up to 2 or 3 thousand very occasionally. Sound familiar?
It is a slow progress but really if they get to the championship they are going to find it hard to compete buying players.
Here is the analogy with Sunderland who are fi di g it impossible to compete buying players.
So how the heck are sunderland going to compete if they ever get to the epl again. Any new owner will have to put in millions and millions and unfortunately  the market appears to be soaring above the reach of all but a few clubs at the top of the epl.
What are the odds of the much vaunted  super league coming about sooner rather than later which I believe will be good for British football allowing the less affluent clubs to compete better amongst themselves.
This is not a doom and gloom post but what I feel is a real look at the task. Not Chris Coleman's task really but a Bain task I feel as Short appears to be missing in action.
We obviously need new owners with lots of spare cash. Is that likely?
Probably not but we live in hope.
You are right, we won't be able to compete at the top unless a Saudi Arabian prince comes in and Short finally rides off into the sunset. But even an average consortium of businessmen should be able to provide the funds to allow us to belong to the next level down.

So again you are right and maybe the time has come for the top 6 to hive themselves off to form a European Super League and leave the rest of us to at least be competitive within British football.

Not that we are even bottom of the Premiership level at the minute like. But we will be again, because this time we have the right man in Coleman. I can feel the bond growing every day. He has the bug, he is making that lifelong connection. He understands US, and what we, as supporters, want from our club. It won't be this year, but it may well be next, if he has anything to do with it. I am sure. Very Happy
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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Sid MCFC on 2018-01-12, 12:55 pm

canary-dave wrote:Sid won't thank me for reminding him of this but a few years ago when Citeh were trying to get back up the leagues they were drawn against Lincoln in the League Cup. I was living in Lincoln at the time and went to the match which Lincoln won 4-1 in the home leg. 

A friend of mine at the time was a Lincoln supporter and asked me to go with him to the return leg at Maine Road. Man. City totally dominated the match and hit the woodwork several times but couldn't put the ball in the net, Lincoln had a break away in the second half and scored, ending up 1-0 winners. 

At the final whistle the Lincoln team came over to the away crowd to thank the supporters and to a man, the whole lot of Man. City supporters rose and applauded the Lincoln team. I have had a soft spot for them ever since, they must have been gutted but were very sporting.
Haha I don’t mind at all Dave, the truth should never hurt and thanks for the compliment btw.  

I have to admit though I didn’t particularly enjoy Wycombe Wanderers taking 6 points off us when we were in the third tier affraid
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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Hieronymus on 2018-01-12, 1:00 pm

Sid MCFC wrote:I’ve avoided posting for a little while as I would hate it if you thought I was being somehow patronising. I think it’s pretty obvious how much I like and respect Sunderland fans and I assure you I know how you are feeling. 

 It damn near took over my life when City were really really shit but I did keep on going although it was a little hard dragging my sons there.  As Kipper suggested because we kept our season tickets instead of going to two pre season friendlies at Scarborough in the bad days one of my sons is coming to Basel with me next month.

Fans will never have any say in who owns their club but I’ve always felt it’s the fans that truly own the club.  If I’d been asked not so many years ago if City would ever again get in the top ten of the prem I would have laughed my head off.  I’m stunned to see how Short is treating a great club and pray you will sooner rather than later get an owner the fans deserve.

I’m certainly not suggesting that fans should keep attending as I can understand the thinking behind not lining that arseholes pocket any more but I do hope you keep your chins up and stay proud of a traditional marvellous club.

I wouldn’t dream of posting on any other clubs forum but really like being associated with the Sunderland fans albeit in a very minor way.  You’ve got a hell of a lot going for you but maybe you can’t see it at the moment.

Anyway enough of all that sloppiness I’ll be watching you tomorrow and wish you all the very best.
Thank you. You are always welcome. Your posts are friendly and informative and never patronising.

Like Dave I have always had a soft spot for Man City fans ever since THAT relegation match when 10000+ Sunderland fans including me, took over one end of Maine Road and Sir Niall Quinn scored against us. There was no trouble and Man City players and fans alike applauded us at the end. Yes, we were relegated but we went down fighting and it was a glorious defeat! Peter Reid and Niall Quinn have both said that was the day they began their love affair with SAFC.

Now, I am sure Sheik Mansour has a brother or sister looking for a sleeping giant to invest in, so can you point them in our direction please? Laughing
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Re: Like MOST marriages ......

Post  Sid MCFC on 2018-01-12, 1:07 pm

Hieronymus wrote:
Sid MCFC wrote:I’ve avoided posting for a little while as I would hate it if you thought I was being somehow patronising. I think it’s pretty obvious how much I like and respect Sunderland fans and I assure you I know how you are feeling. 

 It damn near took over my life when City were really really shit but I did keep on going although it was a little hard dragging my sons there.  As Kipper suggested because we kept our season tickets instead of going to two pre season friendlies at Scarborough in the bad days one of my sons is coming to Basel with me next month.

Fans will never have any say in who owns their club but I’ve always felt it’s the fans that truly own the club.  If I’d been asked not so many years ago if City would ever again get in the top ten of the prem I would have laughed my head off.  I’m stunned to see how Short is treating a great club and pray you will sooner rather than later get an owner the fans deserve.

I’m certainly not suggesting that fans should keep attending as I can understand the thinking behind not lining that arseholes pocket any more but I do hope you keep your chins up and stay proud of a traditional marvellous club.

I wouldn’t dream of posting on any other clubs forum but really like being associated with the Sunderland fans albeit in a very minor way.  You’ve got a hell of a lot going for you but maybe you can’t see it at the moment.

Anyway enough of all that sloppiness I’ll be watching you tomorrow and wish you all the very best.
Thank you. You are always welcome. Your posts are friendly and informative and never patronising.

Like Dave I have always had a soft spot for Man City fans ever since THAT relegation match when 10000+ Sunderland fans including me, took over one end of Maine Road and Sir Niall Quinn scored against us. There was no trouble and Man City players and fans alike applauded us at the end. Yes, we were relegated but we went down fighting and it was a glorious defeat! Peter Reid and Niall Quinn have both said that was the day they began their love affair with SAFC.

Now, I am sure Sheik Mansour has a brother or sister looking for a sleeping giant to invest in, so can you point them in our direction please? Laughing
Thank you very much H.

I’ll do my best with the sheik but sadly not too hopeful. The bugger’s not even answered any of my love letters yet Crying or Very sad
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