SunderMad
Why not join in with our small but perfectly formed community?

We are always looking for new members so sign up and join in, its free.

SOME PEOPLE SEEM TO HIT A SNAG WHEN TRYING TO REGISTER! NOT SURE WHY? IF YOU HAVE A PROBLEM EMAIL ME AND I WILL SORT IT?
sundamad@aol.com
Sky Sports-SunderMad Exclusive.
2017/18

Latest topics
Who is online?
In total there are 11 users online :: 0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 11 Guests :: 2 Bots

None

[ View the whole list ]


Most users ever online was 328 on 2012-09-14, 11:57 am

Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  cyprussyd on 2017-10-12, 12:52 pm

SUNDERLAND will be receptive to January offers for Lamine Kone, Jack Rodwell and Didier Ndong if Ellis Short has been unable to sell the club before the transfer window reopens

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
SUNDERLAND will be receptive to January offers for Lamine Kone, Jack Rodwell and Didier Ndong if Ellis Short has been unable to sell the club before…
THENORTHERNECHO.CO.UK

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 42372
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Vincemac on 2017-10-12, 1:02 pm

Nowt new there 
Short wants as much money as he can get
avatar
Vincemac
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 6594
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 65

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  cyprussyd on 2017-10-12, 1:05 pm

Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 42372
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Vincemac on 2017-10-12, 1:08 pm

cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.
Weather he agrees or not he will still take as much money as he can 
Note I never said 
He is stripping us of our assets
avatar
Vincemac
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 6594
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 65

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Kipper on 2017-10-12, 1:50 pm

cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

Do most fans think that about N'Dong? I certainly don't. I'm not sure what you mean by no end product. Goals? That's an end product but not what he was brought in for. I think he great and I seem to remember so did you at the begining of the season. What I see is someone who generally puts in more effort than most, is not afraid to get stuck in and who's passing is better than loads we've had. Don't turn your back on him just because he hasn't absolutely maintained early season form and you think he may go anyway. I think he's an asset to Sunderland - unfortunately that's where Short's thinking comes in: Saleable assets= get rid.
avatar
Kipper
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 575
Join date : 2016-03-17

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Vincemac on 2017-10-12, 1:54 pm

Kipper wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

Do most fans think that about N'Dong? I certainly don't. I'm not sure what you mean by no end product. Goals? That's an end product but not what he was brought in for. I think he great and I seem to remember so did you at the begining of the season. What I see is someone who generally puts in more effort than most, is not afraid to get stuck in and who's passing is better than loads we've had. Don't turn your back on him just because he hasn't absolutely maintained early season form and you think he may go anyway. I think he's an asset to Sunderland - unfortunately that's where Short's thinking comes in: Saleable assets= get rid.
I also have no problem with ndong
He is as good if not better than what we have 
Yes people get on his back and call him ding dong 
But not me he is an asset to our fair but underperforming squad
avatar
Vincemac
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 6594
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 65

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  sunderpitt on 2017-10-12, 1:56 pm

If the sales go through... What will the cash be used for... would it for instance be made available to Grayson for new players  

            Razz  Razz
avatar
sunderpitt
Number Cruncher
Number Cruncher

Posts : 6096
Join date : 2012-08-25

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Hieronymus on 2017-10-12, 2:27 pm

Kipper wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

Do most fans think that about N'Dong? I certainly don't. I'm not sure what you mean by no end product. Goals? That's an end product but not what he was brought in for. I think he great and I seem to remember so did you at the begining of the season. What I see is someone who generally puts in more effort than most, is not afraid to get stuck in and who's passing is better than loads we've had. Don't turn your back on him just because he hasn't absolutely maintained early season form and you think he may go anyway. I think he's an asset to Sunderland - unfortunately that's where Short's thinking comes in: Saleable assets= get rid.
I agree with you Kipper, N'Dong is energetic, gets stuck in and is all over the pitch during a game. He has the makings of a very good Premier League player I think, but that is why he is considered an asset to sell I guess. And no I would not expect any income from sales to be put back into the team. Ir is all going to pay off debt so when Short sells up for a reduced price, he still has most of his investment back. Crying or Very sad
avatar
Hieronymus
Admin Problem Solver
Admin Problem Solver

Posts : 8413
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 61

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Vincemac on 2017-10-12, 7:20 pm

sunderpitt wrote:If the sales go through... What will the cash be used for... would it for instance be made available to Grayson for new players  

            Razz  Razz
No it will go in shorts pocket 
That’s what his intention is 
Sell the stock pocket the mone before he sells the team
avatar
Vincemac
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 6594
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 65

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Vincemac on 2017-10-12, 7:21 pm

Hieronymus wrote:
Kipper wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

Do most fans think that about N'Dong? I certainly don't. I'm not sure what you mean by no end product. Goals? That's an end product but not what he was brought in for. I think he great and I seem to remember so did you at the begining of the season. What I see is someone who generally puts in more effort than most, is not afraid to get stuck in and who's passing is better than loads we've had. Don't turn your back on him just because he hasn't absolutely maintained early season form and you think he may go anyway. I think he's an asset to Sunderland - unfortunately that's where Short's thinking comes in: Saleable assets= get rid.
I agree with you Kipper, N'Dong is energetic, gets stuck in and is all over the pitch during a game. He has the makings of a very good Premier League player I think, but that is why he is considered an asset to sell I guess. And no I would not expect any income from sales to be put back into the team. Ir is all going to pay off debt so when Short sells up for a reduced price, he still has most of his investment back. Crying or Very sad
Correct
avatar
Vincemac
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 6594
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 65

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  cyprussyd on 2017-10-12, 7:40 pm

Hieronymus wrote:
Kipper wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

Do most fans think that about N'Dong? I certainly don't. I'm not sure what you mean by no end product. Goals? That's an end product but not what he was brought in for. I think he great and I seem to remember so did you at the begining of the season. What I see is someone who generally puts in more effort than most, is not afraid to get stuck in and who's passing is better than loads we've had. Don't turn your back on him just because he hasn't absolutely maintained early season form and you think he may go anyway. I think he's an asset to Sunderland - unfortunately that's where Short's thinking comes in: Saleable assets= get rid.
I agree with you Kipper, N'Dong is energetic, gets stuck in and is all over the pitch during a game. He has the makings of a very good Premier League player I think, but that is why he is considered an asset to sell I guess. And no I would not expect any income from sales to be put back into the team. Ir is all going to pay off debt so when Short sells up for a reduced price, he still has most of his investment back. Crying or Very sad
NDong is indeed full of energy but after a good start IMO he is not improving, lots of running and accepting the ball but what does he do with it, Mcnair may well be a better option.

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 42372
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  talcnturnip on 2017-10-12, 8:27 pm

Got to go with syd on this one Kone wanted away last year and more than likely still wants away, Rodwell just needs to go where is anyone’s guess and Ndong after a good first few games partnering Catts he has gone off the boil, as has Catts.
We all knew this would happen with Kone and Ndong not sure Rodwell will go anywhere except maybe Darlington on loan, not a fan of Short and like most want him gone not sure we can put this on him although the money as said by most will again be spirited away.

________________________________________________________
"If I had to choose between dribbling past 5 players and scoring from 40 yards at Anfield or shagging Miss World , it would be a hard choice.
Thankfully I've done both"
George Best
avatar
talcnturnip
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 2912
Join date : 2012-08-04
Location : South Shields

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  cyprussyd on 2017-10-12, 9:01 pm

For what its worth I think any sales will fund new players through a reduction in the wage bill and some for transfer fees. The bulk however will reduce debt because that gives Short some money back and makes the club more saleable.

I think the masterplan in the summer was to use the sale of Kpne to bring in McCormack but that plan was scuppered when no one came in for Kone.

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 42372
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  lesmac on 2017-10-12, 10:29 pm

Hieronymus wrote:
Kipper wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

Do most fans think that about N'Dong? I certainly don't. I'm not sure what you mean by no end product. Goals? That's an end product but not what he was brought in for. I think he great and I seem to remember so did you at the begining of the season. What I see is someone who generally puts in more effort than most, is not afraid to get stuck in and who's passing is better than loads we've had. Don't turn your back on him just because he hasn't absolutely maintained early season form and you think he may go anyway. I think he's an asset to Sunderland - unfortunately that's where Short's thinking comes in: Saleable assets= get rid.
I agree with you Kipper, N'Dong is energetic, gets stuck in and is all over the pitch during a game. He has the makings of a very good Premier League player I think, but that is why he is considered an asset to sell I guess. And no I would not expect any income from sales to be put back into the team. Ir is all going to pay off debt so when Short sells up for a reduced price, he still has most of his investment back. Crying or Very sad
H Would you sell your new home at a loss?
avatar
lesmac
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 2601
Join date : 2012-08-03
Location : North Northumberland

http://lesmcleanphotography.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  lesmac on 2017-10-12, 10:36 pm

Vincemac wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.
Weather he agrees or not he will still take as much money as he can 
Note I never said 
He is stripping us of our assets
Short purchased the club so that makes the assets his. We are only supporters, granted mostly loyal and passionate but with no connection to ownership. I'm as fed up with things as just about every supporter but will not spread idle and unproven gossip about anyone involved with running the club.
avatar
lesmac
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 2601
Join date : 2012-08-03
Location : North Northumberland

http://lesmcleanphotography.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Hieronymus on 2017-10-13, 12:10 am

lesmac wrote:
Hieronymus wrote:
Kipper wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

Do most fans think that about N'Dong? I certainly don't. I'm not sure what you mean by no end product. Goals? That's an end product but not what he was brought in for. I think he great and I seem to remember so did you at the begining of the season. What I see is someone who generally puts in more effort than most, is not afraid to get stuck in and who's passing is better than loads we've had. Don't turn your back on him just because he hasn't absolutely maintained early season form and you think he may go anyway. I think he's an asset to Sunderland - unfortunately that's where Short's thinking comes in: Saleable assets= get rid.
I agree with you Kipper, N'Dong is energetic, gets stuck in and is all over the pitch during a game. He has the makings of a very good Premier League player I think, but that is why he is considered an asset to sell I guess. And no I would not expect any income from sales to be put back into the team. Ir is all going to pay off debt so when Short sells up for a reduced price, he still has most of his investment back. Crying or Very sad
H Would you sell your new home at a loss?
If I needed to move, and that need was more important than the potential loss, then of course I would.

But this is an unfair comparison, and it would never happen anyway, because we planned and prepared and made sure our investment was protected at every stage. We chose a high demand location to build in, employed an experienced architect and builder and invested in quality materials and fitting so we ended up with a high spec property. So we basically mitigated any risk by ensuring the finished product would be desirable to anyone looking for a new home in this area. Furthermore we made savings by building the house 'ourself', at a cost significantly less than we would have paid if we bought it as the finished article from a builder. So again by thinking it through and doing a proper cost/benefit analysis before we started, we knew we would never lose out in the future.

On the other hand Short appears to have done none of this planning or preparation, when he decided to buy a football club. He is supposed to be an astute business man, so he should have been well aware of the risks involved. Don't we all know the value of any investment can go down as well as up? And history shows that football clubs rarely (if ever?) make a profit. The fact that investment in the team and managers has ultimately been unsuccessful is largely down to him not doing adequate due diligence, and not having (or not listening to) good, expert advice on the players brought in, or the contracts they were offered.

Anyway, no one should be fooled into thinking Short is losing hundred of millions overall. He has had plenty of return on his investment over the last few years, not least from the 8.5% interest loan repayments to his 'subsidiary' finance companies. So, given his net worth is around £2.3bn, I still say he can afford to take a £50 or £60m hit now, if he wants out.
avatar
Hieronymus
Admin Problem Solver
Admin Problem Solver

Posts : 8413
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 61

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  cyprussyd on 2017-10-13, 7:49 am

It is reported that Short still keeps the club afloat with investment and I personally see no reason to doubt that and not just because Bain says so.

It's strange how he is slated on a daily basis for what he takes out but never appreciated for what he puts in.

It's never been about the finances for me, its all about the miss management.

Anyway I will leave this topic with my usual cry, forget Short tomorrow and get out and support the team.

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 42372
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Kipper on 2017-10-13, 9:28 am

cyprussyd wrote:
Hieronymus wrote:
Kipper wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

Do most fans think that about N'Dong? I certainly don't. I'm not sure what you mean by no end product. Goals? That's an end product but not what he was brought in for. I think he great and I seem to remember so did you at the begining of the season. What I see is someone who generally puts in more effort than most, is not afraid to get stuck in and who's passing is better than loads we've had. Don't turn your back on him just because he hasn't absolutely maintained early season form and you think he may go anyway. I think he's an asset to Sunderland - unfortunately that's where Short's thinking comes in: Saleable assets= get rid.
I agree with you Kipper, N'Dong is energetic, gets stuck in and is all over the pitch during a game. He has the makings of a very good Premier League player I think, but that is why he is considered an asset to sell I guess. And no I would not expect any income from sales to be put back into the team. Ir is all going to pay off debt so when Short sells up for a reduced price, he still has most of his investment back. Crying or Very sad
NDong is indeed full of energy but after a good start IMO he is not improving, lots of running and accepting the ball but what does he do with it, Mcnair may well be a better option.

What he does with it is pass it better than a whole load of others I've seen play in red and white. If he goes he won't get replaced with anyone better. I'm still in denial about him going and as far as I'm concerned he deserves our support. If he gets that maybe he'll see the season out (if he has a choice). Anyway, there's a lot of games to go to January, he's part of the team and we have seen that he can be very good. I say get behind him.
avatar
Kipper
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 575
Join date : 2016-03-17

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Argus on 2017-10-13, 9:54 am

'....The fact that investment in the team and managers has ultimately been unsuccessful is largely down to him not doing adequate due diligence, and not having (or not listening to) good, expert advice on the players brought in, or the contracts they were offered...'

 I watch with great interest as the Short debate continues but I must take issue with the above statement.

I agree wholeheartedly that our player/manager recruitment record over the past 5 years or so has been disastrous but how can anyone blame Short for this failure?

All he does is approve the funding and the rest is down to the management team he employs, exactly the same as in any other business.

That problem can be laid squarely and unquestionably at the feet of Margaret Byrne and to a much lesser extent Martin Bain.

Seems to me that Short is a very convenient sacrificial lamb and people seem to forget that he was hailed a bit of a coup when Niall announced his takeover. At last we had a wealthy man who could take us forward.

Perhaps we should blame Quinn for all of this?
Did he do his due diligence on Short?

Personally I am not interested one iota how much money Short takes out of the club since it's HIS business and like it or not, that's the rules of the game and I know that at sometime in the future he will join Cowie and Murray on the list of owners who departed the club as 'failures' (sic).

________________________________________________________
Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you on experience.
avatar
Argus
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 308
Join date : 2012-08-06
Age : 73
Location : Morpeth

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Vincemac on 2017-10-13, 10:05 am

Argus wrote:'....The fact that investment in the team and managers has ultimately been unsuccessful is largely down to him not doing adequate due diligence, and not having (or not listening to) good, expert advice on the players brought in, or the contracts they were offered...'

 I watch with great interest as the Short debate continues but I must take issue with the above statement.

I agree wholeheartedly that our player/manager recruitment record over the past 5 years or so has been disastrous but how can anyone blame Short for this failure?

All he does is approve the funding and the rest is down to the management team he employs, exactly the same as in any other business.

That problem can be laid squarely and unquestionably at the feet of Margaret Byrne and to a much lesser extent Martin Bain.

Seems to me that Short is a very convenient sacrificial lamb and people seem to forget that he was hailed a bit of a coup when Niall announced his takeover. At last we had a wealthy man who could take us forward.

Perhaps we should blame Quinn for all of this?
Did he do his due diligence on Short?

Personally I am not interested one iota how much money Short takes out of the club since it's HIS business and like it or not, that's the rules of the game and I know that at sometime in the future he will join Cowie and Murray on the list of owners who departed the club as 'failures' (sic).


Personally I am not interested one iota how much money Short takes out of the club since it's HIS business and like it or not, that's the rules of the game and I know that at sometime in the future he will join Cowie and Murray on the list of owners who departed the club as 'failures' (sic)




It’s his business there is nowt we can do about it 
avatar
Vincemac
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 6594
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 65

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  cyprussyd on 2017-10-13, 10:24 am

Kipper wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:
Hieronymus wrote:
Kipper wrote:
cyprussyd wrote:Kone wants out and has for some time
Rodwell I am told everyone wants out
N'Dong for me still has no end product

Not sure why Short gets the blame for agreeing with most fans.

Do most fans think that about N'Dong? I certainly don't. I'm not sure what you mean by no end product. Goals? That's an end product but not what he was brought in for. I think he great and I seem to remember so did you at the begining of the season. What I see is someone who generally puts in more effort than most, is not afraid to get stuck in and who's passing is better than loads we've had. Don't turn your back on him just because he hasn't absolutely maintained early season form and you think he may go anyway. I think he's an asset to Sunderland - unfortunately that's where Short's thinking comes in: Saleable assets= get rid.
I agree with you Kipper, N'Dong is energetic, gets stuck in and is all over the pitch during a game. He has the makings of a very good Premier League player I think, but that is why he is considered an asset to sell I guess. And no I would not expect any income from sales to be put back into the team. Ir is all going to pay off debt so when Short sells up for a reduced price, he still has most of his investment back. Crying or Very sad
NDong is indeed full of energy but after a good start IMO he is not improving, lots of running and accepting the ball but what does he do with it, Mcnair may well be a better option.

What he does with it is pass it better than a whole load of others I've seen play in red and white. If he goes he won't get replaced with anyone better. I'm still in denial about him going and as far as I'm concerned he deserves our support. If he gets that maybe he'll see the season out (if he has a choice). Anyway, there's a lot of games to go to January, he's part of the team and we have seen that he can be very good. I say get behind him.
He gets my support every game and I will be there tomorrow supporting him again. His passing however, in my humble opinion is often sideways, yes he may well come good but I still think McNair will be a better option.

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 42372
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Hieronymus on 2017-10-13, 10:59 am

Argus wrote:'....The fact that investment in the team and managers has ultimately been unsuccessful is largely down to him not doing adequate due diligence, and not having (or not listening to) good, expert advice on the players brought in, or the contracts they were offered...'

 I watch with great interest as the Short debate continues but I must take issue with the above statement.

I agree wholeheartedly that our player/manager recruitment record over the past 5 years or so has been disastrous but how can anyone blame Short for this failure?

All he does is approve the funding and the rest is down to the management team he employs, exactly the same as in any other business.

That problem can be laid squarely and unquestionably at the feet of Margaret Byrne and to a much lesser extent Martin Bain.

Seems to me that Short is a very convenient sacrificial lamb and people seem to forget that he was hailed a bit of a coup when Niall announced his takeover. At last we had a wealthy man who could take us forward.

Perhaps we should blame Quinn for all of this?
Did he do his due diligence on Short?

Personally I am not interested one iota how much money Short takes out of the club since it's HIS business and like it or not, that's the rules of the game and I know that at sometime in the future he will join Cowie and Murray on the list of owners who departed the club as 'failures' (sic).
Sorry Argus, I have seen a number of journalistic articles, not just fans forums, saying Short had the final say on all acquisitions. Margaret Byrne's name might have been on the contracts but Short was the decision maker. Believe it or not, makes no difference to me, either. And yes of course it is his club, so that is why he carries the can for all the disastrous signings, managers and players.

And no I am sure Quinn did not do due diligence on Short. He was just pleased to find a 'saviour', as were we all at the time. We should have known better. Do some googling and look at how Short made his money. Out of the wreckage of people's lives by buying up 'distressed assets' and selling them for a profit. Some 'businessman' IMO!
avatar
Hieronymus
Admin Problem Solver
Admin Problem Solver

Posts : 8413
Join date : 2012-08-07
Age : 61

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  cyprussyd on 2017-10-13, 11:16 am

Hieronymus wrote:
Argus wrote:'....The fact that investment in the team and managers has ultimately been unsuccessful is largely down to him not doing adequate due diligence, and not having (or not listening to) good, expert advice on the players brought in, or the contracts they were offered...'

 I watch with great interest as the Short debate continues but I must take issue with the above statement.

I agree wholeheartedly that our player/manager recruitment record over the past 5 years or so has been disastrous but how can anyone blame Short for this failure?

All he does is approve the funding and the rest is down to the management team he employs, exactly the same as in any other business.

That problem can be laid squarely and unquestionably at the feet of Margaret Byrne and to a much lesser extent Martin Bain.

Seems to me that Short is a very convenient sacrificial lamb and people seem to forget that he was hailed a bit of a coup when Niall announced his takeover. At last we had a wealthy man who could take us forward.

Perhaps we should blame Quinn for all of this?
Did he do his due diligence on Short?

Personally I am not interested one iota how much money Short takes out of the club since it's HIS business and like it or not, that's the rules of the game and I know that at sometime in the future he will join Cowie and Murray on the list of owners who departed the club as 'failures' (sic).
Sorry Argus, I have seen a number of journalistic articles, not just fans forums, saying Short had the final say on all acquisitions. Margaret Byrne's name might have been on the contracts but Short was the decision maker. Believe it or not, makes no difference to me, either. And yes of course it is his club, so that is why he carries the can for all the disastrous signings, managers and players.

And no I am sure Quinn did not do due diligence on Short. He was just pleased to find a 'saviour', as were we all at the time. We should have known better. Do some googling and look at how Short made his money. Out of the wreckage of people's lives by buying up 'distressed assets' and selling them for a profit. Some 'businessman' IMO!
And I am sorry H but it beggars belief that anyone could believe that Short decides on players. Yes he signs of the dosh and yes I have also seen the articles that say that but to suggest he sits and says yes I like Rodwell so you can buy him but not keen on McCormack I find unbelievable.

I want Short out and new GOOD owners in but I also like some fairness, Short has also invested but that is never talked about.

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 42372
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Argus on 2017-10-13, 11:29 am

I'm sorry H but when Short took over our club I don't believe he would know the difference between a goalscorer and a goalkeeper so I don't believe for a single moment that he made the final decisions on buying players.

On the moral issue of how he acquired his wealth, let's not forget that he made his money BEFORE the takeover yet I don't recall anyone on this forum having reservations about him then. Most were only too pleased to have acquired a wealthy owner who would fund our dreams.

Whether or not he is a 'good' and worthy owner will always be a matter of conjecture but I'm sure there are many clubs  with the same problem.

The bottom line is that unless we can rattle up £50 - £100 million between us, we fans have no option but to accept the owners we have.

________________________________________________________
Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you on experience.
avatar
Argus
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 308
Join date : 2012-08-06
Age : 73
Location : Morpeth

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  cyprussyd on 2017-10-13, 11:35 am

Argus wrote:I'm sorry H but when Short took over our club I don't believe he would know the difference between a goalscorer and a goalkeeper so I don't believe for a single moment that he made the final decisions on buying players.

On the moral issue of how he acquired his wealth, let's not forget that he made his money BEFORE the takeover yet I don't recall anyone on this forum having reservations about him then. Most were only too pleased to have acquired a wealthy owner who would fund our dreams.

Whether or not he is a 'good' and worthy owner will always be a matter of conjecture but I'm sure there are many clubs  with the same problem.

The bottom line is that unless we can rattle up £50 - £100 million between us, we fans have no option but to accept the owners we have.
I have 4 old pound coins if that helps

________________________________________________________
          My glass is always half full and occasionally over flowing. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
avatar
cyprussyd
Senior Member(Top Cat)
Senior Member(Top Cat)

Posts : 42372
Join date : 2012-07-31
Age : 69
Location : Durham

http://www.sunderlandmad.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Black Cats keen to offload big-name trio during January transfer window

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum